Pajero Owners Club of South Africa

OK. I posted this in the Mitsubishi section, but I have had little response so far. And I need to take this further tomorrow.

I recently bought an 2003 Pajero with 280,000 kms on the clock. After a rather thorough visual inspection I decided to buy it due to the condition of the vehicle. It had a full service history (every 7,500 kms) and incredibly well looked after. It was actually the best looking vehicle up to the 2007 year. So I reckoned that the person that owned it was quite pedantic and a perfectionist.

After buying the vehicle I send it for inspection at AA (visual), then asked my mechanic to look it over based on some recommendations I found here. So, I did everything mentioned and it appears that the car is in a brilliant condition based on a visual but thorough inspection. However, the after driving about 150 km I have noticed excessive diesel usage. It appeared that the car was using about 5 - 7 km per km (rough guess based on the fuel gauge - not accurate). It did not worry me, as I thought that the fuel gauge is a bit inaccurate and that it falls very fast the first half.

After spending alot of time on the forum in the past few weeks (far too much actually) I decided to have one of the Madman 2 EMS units fitted. When I handed in my car to SAC in Centurion today I also decided to get a Unichip, something I have been contemplating (and after I asked alot of questions). In the process SAC put the vehicle on the Dyno and realized that there is something wrong. After some more investigations they found worn injectors that was replaced (after asking me).

However, after fitting the new injectors and putting it on the Dyno they saw that there is something very wrong. The car still develop only 76 kW/290 nm. They informed me with some technical talk that it is likely the fuel pump but they can only be sure once removed and tested (they are 95% sure). They say it is likely damage being the result of dirty fuel somewhere. I was also told that this is not a typical "maintenance issue" so it cannot be seen as wear and tear.

Now, after having spend a few k on the car (4 new injectors, Madman, smash and grab, inspection etc.) I get the news that I may have to spend another R35 k. Now naturally I am not happy. Not happy at all.

First. I trust that Steve's Auto Clinic is highly respected that that their advice is correct (worn fuel pump) and that it is rather expensive to fix. They also mentioned to fix it will result in the car being in the workshop for a week as well as that there are only one company that can fix the pump. Is this correct ... (only one company that can fix ?)

Now second, what to do.
1. I can return the vehicle in terms of the CPA, lose the money spend on it to date as well as lose another few K due to a few typical conditions in the CPA (likely about R15,000 - 20,000 due to admin, etc). I did look at the agreement.
2. I can corner the dealer and ask him to pay for the "damage", or at least come to the party and assist in the covering the costs.
3. I can drive the vehicle as is and see whether it fails. If it fails in 1 year I can use the warrantee and then the dealer are responsible in part for the damage (now the engine, damage estimated at 70 - 80 K). I also have a mechanical breakdown insurance for the next 2 years that will contribute a few K. It also gives me more time to save and prepare for this eventuality. I however have this sword over my head (car) that it can fail when I am somewhere in the field ...

Please assist and highlight the best option.

Hi Morne,

Sorry to hear of your problems.

Can you post a copy of the dyno report on this thread? (Preferably before it was chipped but after the injectors were replaced)

By the way, I would be interested to know:
1. What did they charge you for replacing the injectors? Material + Labour.
2. Were they new or reconditioned ones?

Hi,

When they saw the issue with the fuel pump they didn't fit the chip as they felt that with a fuel pump that are not working properly I will not get a benefit with a potential risk to the engine. Run one is the run with the engine as I brought it in, run two is after they changed the injectors.



I do not know if it was new or recon injectors. Labour to install was R 1,386 and the 4 injectors was R 4,561.

Regards

Morne

I would try the CPA route asap - how long have you had the vehicle? Still a chance that you are in the 'cool off' period after the sale?

After that, your only recourse is probably the dealer. Surely they should have noticed the lack of power compared to the other Pajeros they have!?

Bought the vehicle Wednesday last week ... 8 days (6 working). The cooling off period is 5 days I think.

MorneDJ wrote:Hi,
I do not know if it was new or recon injectors. Labour to install was R 1,386 and the 4 injectors was R 4,561.

At that price I would assume they are reconditioned injectors. New price from Mitsu is a touch under R2800 each.

If the 76kW 290Nm is at the wheels I don't think that is too bad, is it? What figures were SAC expecting? Can anyone comment knowledgeably on this?

With only 4 data points on the chart I don't see how they could reach a conclusion that the pump is bad. Can anyone comment knowledgeably on this?

OK,

I looked a bit further into this.

According to this site ChipIT pajero dyno @ wheels the unchipped 147kW 3.2 DiD shows max 88.9kW at the wheels.

i.e. 57.1kW (or just over 40%) lost in overall drive train including tyre contact losses.

So back of a fag packet you could expect a 121kW engine to give say 121 * 0.6 = 72.6kW at the wheels at wherever the manufacturer quotes max power for this motor.

It goes back to the questions: What power do SAC expect at the wheels as reflected by their dyno and why do they expect that?

As a precautionary measure I had my 2002 3.2 DiD Auto tested at Alan Black on Monday this week and after replacing injectors (refurbished) my dyno figures were 74.8kW @ 3034 rpm and 246Nm @ 2708. About a 5% improvement from before to after and I was already quite happy with the vehicle's performance.

And before anyone mentions it - I recognise that you can't directly compare dyno readings from one dyno with readings from another dyno.

Comments anyone?

OK, so I spoke to the dealer and they seems happy to assist me in resolving this. However, I also took the vehicle to an independent guy that only work on Mitsubishi's (Henk in Wonderboom, did not get his surname). He checked all the error codes then went for a drive in the car with the diagnostics computer (the Mitshubishi computer, not an generic).

Only issue he detected was that two of the wheel sensors were faulty and that the turbo boost is slightly down. Also one of the water pipes appears to be the original one the vehicle left Japan.

I booked it in with him for Monday to resolve all of this on Monday. I will pay this. I will take it back to him next month to remove the diesel pump and have that calibrated and checked.

The dynometer report reports a max of 76.6 kW @ 3,000 and 289 Nm @2,500. I assume that this was at the wheels. So I guess it is not that bad after all.

Where SAC got that I should redo the diesel pump (a hell of a cost) I do not know, a bit frustrating.

I have heard, and read on online car forums, of similar experiences with SAC where they recommend a rebuild/recondition/replacement of a part that is not really necessary. I think it is due to them not specializing in one vehicle but in performance in general so they are not always knowledgeable enough on the specific vehicle or problem.

You can also try/call/speak to Allen Black as he is the guru on diesel pumps and injectors etc. and Henk will most probably send the pump to him anyway, you can go to Allen directly if you want, I know the cost for rebuilding a pump at Allen directly is far less than through a workshop and they send it to him anyway (mitsu at-least does that and charges you 3 arms and kidney and pension for it).

Hi Morne Alan Black is the "Go to" guy for the Diesel pump. The dealers use him as well Speak to Eric 011 811 3490 and tell him you are from the club. Brace yourself, as you are looking at a big bill anyway...